Super grateful for the editors of The Sun Magazine!

Here’s an excerpt. Read the full interview here.

Mishele Maron: In that industry I was living and working with men who were uncommonly aggressive, forthright, and commanding. At certain points I had to find the courage to say to them, “Hey, you’re communicating in a way that is making me shut down.” And a lot of them were taken aback and humbled and even grateful that I’d spoken up. Not all of them, of course, but with most I established a working relationship that helped me understand how isolated these men were. Once I had built a trust with them, they started sharing personal stories with me and asking for advice on how to talk to their wives. And I saw how men, too, are systematically harmed by living inside a patriarchal paradigm. When women are harmed by that paradigm, we at least have each other. We have the language of emotion and connection, and we can talk about what’s going on. These men didn’t have that.